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Washington v. Couric - No Holds Barred

Date Added: Aug. 28, 2004
Last Updated: Aug. 28, 2004

One thing we must remember about e-mail chain letters is that human memory is a very fallable thing. Our recollections are often colored by our preconceptions and values. This chain letter outlines how one person remembers a real event, but some investigation finds that the unidentified author's memory isn't perfect.

Hooray for Denzel Washington

I always kind of liked Denzel.

I bet this one will never see the light of day again. Denzel Washington needs to get on FOX News or Meet The Press.... even Tim Russert would at least listen.

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Did you see the Denzel Washington interview with Katie Couric on NBC last Friday morning (13 August 2004)?

Not many people are talking about it. They are wishing it would go away and are trying to sweep it under the rug.

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Meryl Streep and Denzel were on the today show "live" with Katie Couric to talk about the movie "Manchurian Candidate."

At one point Katie asked Denzel, "have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?" To which Denzel replied, "No, and I have no intentions on seeing it." Katie and Meryl were "so noticeably" taken aback! It was so cool!

Then, a discourse (or more preferably, a fight!) began between all three of them with Denzel being barraged with all kinds of anti-Bush, anti-republican comments, but "the man stood his ground" and soon enraged the women so much that they couldn't get a word in edgewise. Meryl Streep turned blood red and she sat with her legs crossed and her one leg shaking up and down, fuming! Then Katie uttered the words that put the final nail in her coffin, she said to Denzel "you see, that's the problem I have with "you people."

She of course did not get to finish her sentence because Denzel pounced on her verbally by responding "YOU PEOPLE! YOU PEOPLE! Just what do you mean you people! Do you mean "You People" as in me as a Christian, or do you mean "You People" as in me as a REPUBLICAN? She then tap danced her way through the next minute of the show. But Denzel went out fighting and declaring that Fahrenheit 9/11 is nothing but propaganda and lies distorted to support a cynical democratic film director's views.

There's a celebrity that deserves to wear the uniform in movies and I don't mind at all.

On July 28, 2004, after being interviewed for NBC's Today show, Denzel Washington took place in a panel discussion videotaped for Dateline NBC. Also participating in the panel was Meryl Streep, his co-star in the remake of 1962's "Manchurian Candidate," and Jonathan Demme, the film's director. Questioning the panel was venerable Today host, Katie Couric.

The transcript of the panel discussion, posted on NBC's Web site points out many inaccuracies in our anonymous informant's recollection. Here are the Biggies:

What the Chain letter Claims:
"At one point Katie asked Denzel, "have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?" To which Denzel replied, "No, and I have no intentions on seeing it." Katie and Meryl were "so noticeably" taken aback! It was so cool!"

What really happened:
Couric did not bring up Fahrenheit 9/11, Washington did. But his point was not to criticize the film. This exchange happened at the end of the interview, after the other events to which our anonymous author refers:

Couric: "And how do you feel about the current political situation?"

Washington: "You know, I haven't seen ‘Fahrenheit 9/11,’ because I live in America. I grew up here. I'm an ex-slave. I'm a result of what this country can do. So it's nothing knew to me. I'm not surprised at all. It's just business as usual. What I want to talk about is, what are we doing right now, today, for these young kids that are coming home? Are we embracing them? I don't hear about them being lifted up. I mean, I'm not just talking about a parade but—"

What the chain letter claims:
"Then, a discourse (or more preferably, a fight!) began between all three of them with Denzel being barraged with all kinds of anti-Bush, anti-republican comments, but "the man stood his ground" and soon enraged the women so much that they couldn't get a word in edgewise."

What really happened:
At no point did a "fight" containing "anti-bush and anti-republican comments take place. Earlier in the interview, Streep did offer some criticism of President George W. Bush's use of religion in his re-election campaign In response to Couric's question about the actress' attendance at a John Kerry fundraiser:

Streep: "Oh, I was there."

Couric: "I know you were there. And in fact, I read your quote. You said -- you talked about President Bush and his invocation of religion and you said—"

Streep: "No, of Jesus."

Couric: "Of Jesus, sorry. ‘Through the shock and awe, I wondered which of the megaton bombs Jesus, our president's personal savior, would have personally dropped on the sleeping families in Baghdad.’"

Streep: "It was a question about when you put Jesus on the campaign bus to stump for you, you have to really listen to what he says, because he says, ‘If a man smite thee on the cheek, let you turn the other that he may smite it also.’ And he says, ‘He who lives by the sword dies by the sword.’ And he says, ‘Love thine enemy.’ Jesus could have raised an army against the people that persecuted him. He didn't. So that's what I was pointing out in my speech, and I couldn't really imagine Jesus, like I couldn't imagine how Jesus would vote. Jesus was the Prince of Peace. Would the Prince of Peace vote for a war President?"

At this point, Denzel joined the discussion, but this is the closest the discussion came to the heated "discourse" the author seems to remember:

Washington: "And it's open to interpretation. Jesus also went into the temple and kicked everybody out."

Streep: "That's kicking the money-changers out of the temple."

Washington: "Well, you're right. So—"

Streep: "The money-changers should get out of Congress, I agree. And I agree, but he didn't—"

Washington: "He didn't. He didn't only say turn the other cheek though. You’ve got to read the whole book. That's not what all he said."

Streep: "Oh, I do read the whole book."

Washington: "I do too. And that's not all he said."

Streep: "What does he say that said 'pick up a stick and kill somebody?'"

Washington: "Like I said, he did go into the temple and cleared the place well—"

Streep: "Of money, yeah."

Washington: "Okay, well, we're all—"

Streep: "Money's bad."

Washington: "We all make money. So does that make us bad? Maybe he's talking about us?"

Streep: "Well, yeah, maybe."

Couric later called this discussion of the New Testament "an unexpected and volatile sidebar."

What the chain letter claims:
"Meryl Streep turned blood red and she sat with her legs crossed and her one leg shaking up and down, fuming!"

What really happened:
OK, in all fairness, I can't comment on this claim. The transcript has no descriptions of body language or tone of voice and I did not personally see the clip.

What the chain letter claims:
"Then Katie uttered the words that put the final nail in her coffin, she said to Denzel "you see, that's the problem I have with "you people." She of course did not get to finish her sentence because Denzel pounced on her verbally by responding "YOU PEOPLE! YOU PEOPLE! Just what do you mean you people! Do you mean "You People" as in me as a Christian, or do you mean "You People" as in me as a REPUBLICAN?"

What really happened:
Following the Bible discussion, Denzel seems to be having a bit of fun with Couric, taking more umbrage at being lumped in with other actors than in having his faith or political party questioned:

Couric: "Denzel, are you-- do you feel-- you know some people say Hollywood folks should stick to acting."

Washington: "I don't know what Hollywood folks are, first of all. Hollywood is a town that has some stars on the sidewalk. I don't know anybody from there. So, I don't-- that's like saying-- calling you a type of folks. I'm not a Hollywood folk. I don't know who they are."

Couric: "Okay, all right, well, let me rephrase the question. Are you one of those people that—"

Washington: "Ah, there you go. Am I one of those people? Hmmm, isn't that interesting?"

Couric: "Oh, stop, stop, stop."

Washington: "No, don't stop. I heard what you just said. "Am I one of those people?" No, I'm not."

Couric: "No, are you an actor who would rather not—"

Washington: "No, I'm not that either. I'm a human being. My job is acting."

Couric: "Okay, are you somebody who would rather not express his political views publicly? I mean how do you feel about that? Some people are more outspoken than others. And what I meant, are you one of the people who would rather keep it private? Don't make my questions loaded when they're not."

Washington: "Would I rather keep it private? No, I'm not one of those people. I think I speak what's on my mind."

This led into Washington's comments on Fahrenheit 9/11 that the chain letter's author recalls as kicking things off.

What the chain letter claims:
"She then tap danced her way through the next minute of the show. But Denzel went out fighting and declaring that Fahrenheit 9/11 is nothing but propaganda and lies distorted to support a cynical democratic film director's views."

What really happened:
Washington's final remarks expressed concern about our soldiers. Demme got the last word, casting the preceding discussion in a much brighter light than our chain letter's author.

Washington: "You know, I have a son, 19, 19-year-olds are coming home completely different."

Demme: "It's fundamental to a democracy that you're not only permitted to speak out, you're supposed to have an opinion, you're supposed to speak out, you're supposed to engage in a discourse. And in this way, we arrive at ideas that can move us forward in a positive fashion. I wish everybody could get on TV and talk about how they feel. Maybe we'd learn something."

Break this chain.

References: Dateline NBC

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